strut mounting, strut monting

[kenhall1202]

Here is what one of the 'Citroen Guide' authors has to say:

The strut mounts can also cause problems on very early Series 1 XMs. If cracks develop in the vulcanised rubber part connecting the inner and outer parts of the strut, they can separate completely. As a result, the strut will be driven through the hood, puncturing or indenting it rather nastily. This setup was modified very early; later variants, although the rubber can fail, will not let the strut pop out of the hood; however, the steering will become very imprecise and noisy. If you drive the car in this condition for a longer period, this will damage the struts themselves, as well as the steering rack, rod and valve.

The danger is somewhat more imminent on the passenger side as that is closer to the edge of the road where most of the potholes are.

Željko NASTASIĆ

Ken

[Sharo]

Hi Ken, the price was for one sphere support - the price is other now - 240BGN ~ 100GBP.
In bulgarian citroen forum there are pictures from the recycled supports -
this is from 3 years old support:
http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aV1G7l9A
http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=Pq1Mwjg0
however there are rumors that recycled supports are more noisy - whatever that means

[citroenxm]

Wow, A very strong Thread this... Im sorry, Ive nothing to contribute, however, looking at those "Re Conditiond" tops , Id be MORE then happy to drive my SED with them on, compared to the ones on her now! Shes off the road now, while I source all parts to do her up...

Id no idea this was being discussed here... my guilt for not checking in very often..


Paul

[kenhall1202]

Thanks for the info Sharo - it might tempt some XM drivers to spend a holiday in Bulgaria and guess what they will be bringing in their suitcases!!

I had a brief trawl on the Planete- Citroen.com site and there are lots of reports and pictures of failed strut tops. It was noticeable that most of the pictured failures were at the French passenger side (ie their nearside) which corresponds with UK XM experience (ie driver's side most likely to fail first). Whether you drive on the left or right hand side of the road doesn't seem to be a significant factor involved in this common failure.

I took the liberty of copying some pictures of a dissected strut top (with grateful acknowledgment to 'citroeniste56' aka Christophe). Here is one of them

Ken

This post has been edited by kenhall1202 on September 20, 2010 04:18 pm

[messerschmitt owner]

are strut tops still available brand new from Citroen?

[noz]

hi Ken,

Thats a superb photo. It quite clearly shows the dimples on the lower part from the outside as well as the annular recess in the upper part. Exactly as imagined.

As an observation, there is very little bearing surface between the rubber and the lower part. I'm not sure if the strut top ever experiences 'rebound' when going over a pothole but thats a very small rubber to metal contact area to be able to maintain its bond in tension. Overall the part which has the poorest design is the retention of the rubber in the conical recess particularly in tension. In compression its not too bad. However, this works in our favour. We can easily adjust the design to make up for that failing.

cheers

noz

[kenhall1202]

With grateful acknowledgment to '57banane' on Planete-Citroen, looks like he doesn't intend to get a speared bonnet. You could probably suspend the whole car from one of these devices!!

Ken

This post has been edited by kenhall1202 on September 20, 2010 03:23 pm

[kenhall1202]

QUOTE (messerschmitt owner @ September 20, 2010 02:00 pm) 

are strut tops still available brand new from Citroen?

As far as we know but at £422 each they are not exactly flying off the shelves.

Ken

[robert_e_smart]

Very interesting, although I have nothing to contribute, I am very interested in the outcome.

Do you have a direct link to the Planete Citroen thread, where the picture of the dissected strut top came from Ken?

[davetherave]

That does appear to be a rather industrial preventative mesure!

[kenhall1202]

QUOTE (robert_e_smart @ September 21, 2010 11:33 pm) 

Very interesting, although I have nothing to contribute, I am very interested in the outcome.

Do you have a direct link to the Planete Citroen thread, where the picture of the dissected strut top came from Ken?

Hi Robert,

Here is the link to the Planete-Citroen XM forum thead covering strut top failure: http://www.planete-citroen.com/forum/showt...t=support+avant

I'm assuming you are already a member of P-C, if not you may have to register first before you can view the link.

I have translated several of the (many!) posts using Google Translate but I haven't seen any mention of anyone getting the failed rubber renewed as Sharo as previously described.

Ken

[kenhall1202]

Some more tit-bits gleaned from Planete-Citroen (with acknowledgements).

From a German member of P-C ('xmamateur' aka Stephan) posted 5th Sept 2010

French to English translation
Hello

I'm new to the forum. Excuse my French, s.v.p.!
My question: In Germany the domes-front suspension brackets are no longer available in the Citroen network. A small disaster for drivers of XM. How is the situation in France or the network-Citroen PSA french?

Sincerely

Stephan

Replies to his query confirm general disgruntlement and similar high prices in France to the UK and one post quoted a 2 month wait for delivery after ordering two 'domes'. A contributor from Budapest had had his strut tops revulcanised but was not happy with some of the results.

On the question of who makes the 'domes' the French company Barre Thomas of Rennes was quoted as a possibility (apparently they are a former associate company of Citroen). Their website is at http://www.barrethomas.com and their blurb lists Citroen as a customer.

On the strut top modification saga by Citroen it appears that early strut tops were clinched together with only four dimples (as evident in the dissected strut top picture posted earlier). The construction was later modified to increase the dimples to ten. The attached picture shows an unusual failure where the clinching has given way and the central tube has pulled out of the top casting. The accompanying pictures also show a badly buckled wheel which suggest the car was driven at speed over a high kerb.

Ken

Edit
Nearly forgot - in 2008 a petition was kicked off on P-C 'Petition contre le prix abusifs des domes avants XM ET XANTIA'. Obviously the petition has had no effect on Citroen pricing to date.

This post has been edited by kenhall1202 on September 23, 2010 11:12 pm

[robert_e_smart]

The Planete Citroen guys didn't mention repairing strut tops unfortunately. Mainly discussing the hows and whys they fail etc.

[noz]

Hi all,

I think I may have a solution to the strut top problem here:

http://club-xm.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=4903

Please maintain the discussion here or in a new thread rather than in the Self-Help section.

cheers

noz

[xmexclusive]

Hi Noz

Interesting to see your thoughts.

A couple of comments relative to existing Citroen designs:
The original rubber insert has deep voids cast into it.
I think this is to make the resiliance soft laterally while stiff longways.
On late Mk2's the bellows and its top fixing changes.
I have not yet found one to measure but suspect it also changes the design to prevent pop through on failure.

With the repair proposals it would be a bonus if failure pop through prevention could be incorporated. I also suspect that in service rusting will become more of a problem due to the increase in capilliary prone interfaces. That might well be something we have to live with.

John