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Full Version When Is A Series 2 Not A Series 2

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Gav
now i dont expect citroen to be any different from any other organisation but i own an early series 2 and whenever i try to find information on certain components i either find my car simply does not posses them or the information is missing for these early periods.

to date i find in the various manuals but not on the car:
* deadlocks missing
* no anti-pinch drivers window controls (but i do have one touch)
* no evidence of the RF remote
* dubious details for the sphere settings

does anybody know of any other differences i should look out for ?
techmanagain
I thought that I was the only person who invariably had cars made in between change dates! By my reckoning, your car was made on Oct 5th 1994. The generally accepted date for the introduction of alll the S2 mods was, i believe, July 1st 1995. So you have a S1 car with the introduction of a few mods but not all of them ,IMHO. Don't blame the stores staff when you get the wrong part if you don't quote your VIN number when ordering! techmanagain
DerekW
It's one of the fabled Series One-and-a-halfs!

Derek
jorgy9
My XM is of April '94 and like yours a Mark "1.5". I'm in doubt as well about various details the most important being the spheres specs. Unfortunately I don't know much about it. When I bought new spheres I did so from the online shop of Autospares, because they were the only source I found that were listing (and providing) different sphere specifications depending on date of production. This satisfied me that I would get the right spheres but finally they sent old regassed spheres -when they were supposed to be new ones-, with different orifice diameters even between sets of corners spheres -i.e. front orifices were diferent between them- ! So I wouldn't recommend them, but it would be interesting to know where their information is based upon -unfortunately they don't list sphere specs but only some sphere codes-.

If you look at this topic

http://club-xm.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=734

Noz has posted a PDF with spheres specs but I'm not sure whether those are valid for all XMs or Hydractive I only.

George
Peter.N.
My car was registered in Jan '96 and yet twice I ordered a new radiator for it and the wrong one came, I subsequently found that is was actually a '95 model! although definitly a Mk2. I have seen cars advertised on e-bay that by their registration should have been Mk2s and yet they had Mk1 grills and dashboards, so who knows? If it has the chevrons in the centre of the grill and a curved top to the instrument panel it will definitly be a Mk2 but changes seem to continually be made. My previous car was also registered in Jan '96 and had an almost identical registration number but it has a different injection pump and auxilluary belt arrangement.

Peter.N.
citroenxm
Hi Peter N

Not necesserally. The grill signifies series 1.5 onwards.

My 1993 K reg series one and a half has the Chevrons in the centre..

Mmmmmm

Slow production change run..

Regards
citroenxm
Peter.N.
Hi citroenxm

Does it have the late instrument panel?

Peter
citroenxm
Hi Peter..

Instruments?? Was there a difference, apart from Electronic speedo?? Thought the clocks were the same..

I have series one dash though! Thank god, more original and different.

Regards
citroenxm
DerekW
I'm sure that on the production line at changeover they carried on using the existing parts bins until they were exhausted. That would explain the mixed specifications on the "1.5" cars.

Incidentally, mine was first registered in 1999 but the RP No. shows it to be a 2000 model.

Derek
Peter.N.
DerekW

If your '99/00 is a 2.1 td manual estate I'l buy it off you!

citroenxm.

I meant the instrument housing, I take it yours has a flat top that you can stand a cup of tea on, much more useful. Is it possible that yours has had a replacement grill sometime? Only the Mk2 grill didn't start to be used officially until late '94.

Peter.
citroenxm
Hi Peter!

Yes flat top, handy for McDonalds drinks and ice creams too!!

Grill: A possibility, as I'm sure its had a front end shunt, as the wing is out of line, and after removal of the front (TWICE) for starter motor reasons the end chassis where the front hangs onto is a little crumpled. Nothing majour just a tiny bit, so your theroy could well be correct.

Oh well, a good bit to sell when the auto box packs up and writes the car off!

Regards
citroenxm
xmexclusive
Hi Gav and All

Your original post seems to have well and truly raised the XM series 1.5 myths!
It is not something that I subscribe to!

From a study of the brochures I have concluded that the model year for the XM started on the 1 July of the proceeding year. So the first Mk2's were available in the show rooms from 1 July 1994 and were 1995 model year cars. Factory production of Mk2's must have started some months earlier. I suspect that they changed from Mk1 to Mk2 one production line at a time clearing the bins and restocking with new components. Mixed component cars are most unlikely from the factory but I believe that I have seen the results of some remarkable two into one XM transformations in my recent years of XM viewing.

That should cause a few ruffled feathers!

Now with regard to you car and queries:

Your car is a 2.5 TD. This engine was never available or fitted to a production MK1
so it is clear that your car is a full blooded Mk2.
The electric door locks, door wiring loom and remote control are physically different between GB Mk1's and Mk2's. The differences are HF remote system (radio frequency) and dead locking. The dead locking only works off the second button of the remote, so if you do not have a working MK2 remote system then you will not be able to use the deadlocks but they are still present in the car.
The same logic applies to the anti-pinch. There is no switch to operate the anti-pinch and so no physical sign that it is present. It is an automatic protection system and the only way to find out if it is working is to operate the window with a lump of wood stuck in it to simulate your arm.
Noz's manual confirms that all of these features were available in the GB 1995 model year cars so all Mk2's should have these features. Whether they still work is another matter. If you are anywhere near me in Hampshire then I will be pleased to help with looking at the remote locking and have a spare working Mk2 remote and receiver to use for testing.

Regards

XMexc
citroenxm
Hi xmexeclusive

With reference to the lack of useing deadlocking with no remote. What about locking the car with the lock but HOLD THE KEY in the position for a second or so!

If its anything like Xantia system the deadlocks should then kick in as it does on Xantias. Simply unlocking the car on the key then unlocks and releases the deadlocks.. Can any Mk.2 owner try this and let any of us know.....

regards
citroenxm
xmexclusive
Hi Citroenxm and All

Thank you, I have just checked and you are right about being able to engage the deadlocks by holding the key in the turned position for a few seconds. It worked on the oldest of my Mk2's, the only one I have tried so far.
I qualify for the booby prize as I have owned a Mk2 for 5 years and even spent the first year using a manual key not realising I could have deadlocked the car while I waited for a back ordered plip set to come from France.

It is the combined experience of the members of this group that make it so powerful in problem solving.

Regards

XMexc
Gav
myths and legends. I seem to have started something here. What got me going on this was reviewing the workshop manuals. looking through to see the relevent pages for my orga no. 6540.

there seems no doubt that from orga 6383 is when mark 2 started and obviously many variations / improvements were developed from that point on. eg. lots of electrical changes but also things like the 2.5d camshaft mod came after my cars birth.

i grant you that the central locking is almost certainly just duff. but the intriging bit for me is the seemingly complete lack of the mechanism for dead locks. having stripped the door down to fix the errant winder cable (halfords £4.99 for mountain bike cable - nipple one end goes in the drum, tie a knot in the other on the slider - works fine) i dont recall seeing deadlock mechanism, nor any evidence on the outside of the door skin. what should i be looking for?

Likewise the window anti-pinch. i have tried resetting the device per the instructions for the drivers door but it does not follow the reset pattern. i would have guessed the mechanism had been swapped in the past for a mk1 but the with the one touch the general consensus is this cant be.

when it comes to xm's i guess curiousity is a dangerous thing!

btw xmexclusive... is you dont want your spare plip and receiver i would be most grateful... i'm top end of m3. would be good to get a southern meet sorted so we can all compare cars.
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