I keep reading in the newspapers about the difficulty that manufacturers are having in shifting their stocks of cars - fields of them - airports of them standing there waiting for someone to buy them.

If they were to drop their prices down to what the rest of the world pays they might shift some of them. but they hope they can keep on ripping off the British milchcow. And now they want the government to bail them out with yet more of our money!

That's my rant of the week over.

Derek

Just think

---- if Citroen are only shifting C6s by registering them to dealers and then dribbling them through the auctions, the figures may well show it to be one of the least affected bigger cars in the current meltdown. Whereas Merc and the like are probably losing thousands of sales, Citroen may only lose a couple of the handful they seem to have had for the C6. I'm sure a good ad agency should be able to conveniently avoid the percentages issue and point out the virtues of a model so little affected by recession. Either that or they will use the present situation as the reason to finish the model altogether.

Mike.

PSA and the like have apparently been hit hard, with thousands of jobs going.

I heard a nasty rumour they were stopping production of the C6, but its this far unsubstantiated.

Ciarán

Perhaps we could all volunteer for the production line

What else can we expect - with ridiculas Taxes, high fuel cost (that has subsided thank god!) We CANNOT trust this goverment. What was the original proposal not so long ago?? A Mondeo Road tax would soar to OVER £200 a YEAR! How many familys can afford that! So with that in mind despite what they are trying to tell us they may change their minds about it - I for one CANNOT trust them for one second...

So, would you buy a new car with a risk of wondering "Oooooo is my road tax going to soar to a stupid level?" I dont think so, so Ill keep the car I got with less outlay!"

My rant over... if you can follow it!

Rgds
paul

Hi all,

Sorry to raise a worrying prospect at this time. I read that President Sarkozy is to introduce a scheme in France whereby 1000 euros will be paid for crushing and old car if replaced with a new energy efficient model.

I would not bet against a similar scheme here which would raise the minimum price for an XM to the amount of the subsidy. That would wipe out most XM ownership in short order with no cars available for spares.

The alleged case that the new car will consume more energy in its production than in driving it over its average life is ignored.


Robert.

Sorry, But NO ONES thousand pounds would get me out of my old cars!!

I JUST do not like news oes, couldn't afford monthly payments on top of insurance payments, then the worry of an electronic breakdown meaning more payment!!!
Oh and fuel on top...

At the moment, its just insurance and fuel, and anything break D I Myself!!!

There will ALWAYS be people that WILL not buy a new car!

I realise thought, it may get rid of the few that could still be in the hands of "Bought because its cheap, run till it stops" people..

Rgds
Paul

Hey Guys ----

Gordon has saved the world -- he's told us so. Must be just a bit delayed in those bits of the world that affect the vast majority of people !

The people in this country need to start realising just what a set of mugs they are being taken for by the self serving, grasping politicians. It's long overdue that the politicians were reminded they are our servants, not our masters.

Two changes I'd make now --- first, an end to the present up to five year term of government. I'd have something like a fifth of the b*****s up for election every year, so none of them could get too comfy.

Second --- a statutory right to a binding referendum on any issue, once a predetermined number of voters have called for one.

Mike.

Hi Derek

Having worked for a number of international companies that have had country specific price lists (I assume that car comapnies are much the same). The companies price their goods according to what they think they can get for them. Hence in Britain we have traditionally paid more for cars than in Europe / vastly more than the USA and we will continue to do so if consumers continue to pay for them. Simple supply and demand really. This will change when supply dries up - which it is looking to do. I'm sure that if you went into a car dealship next week (it is end of year afterall and salespeople will be trying to get nearer targets) and put down a cheeky offer someone would negotiate with you.

The other issue which comes with supply and demand. If people aren't buying new cars (and we have the same number of drivers) this will squeeze the used car market - although there will be a long lag time, meaning that we will be back to rip off Britain - although for used cars this time. You can see this with other countries which haven't had the consumer credit boom (and now bust) where used cars are much more expensive because there isn't the flow of nearly new used cars into the market.

Finally - rant over - there are some positives to the current economic climate. Working for a company that exports (plus all the car factories in the UK that predominantly export) the value of the pound makes our goods seriously good value abroad. I wish there were only more companies that also exported.

Cheers

Tony

Hi Rowanmoor.

All very valid points. The problem I think we now have in many parts of the world is that the ruling elite use a veneer of democracy to legitimise whatever course of action they want to take, with absolutely no regard for the true wishes of the people. That may be just about acceptable if they genuinely worked for the common good, but as the last years have shown, they tend to be spectacularly inept and self serving (at best !). When, for example, did you last have any contact from your Euro MP, or notification of where you might see them locally ? I'm guessing never. You can bet next year you'll be getting a leaflet and love and kisses from him / her as the Euro elections approach and they want your vote to shoehorn themselves back into the gravy train.

I do think your view on the absolute selfishness of the electorate is maybe a little OTT. While undoubtedly some people are like that, I think many do take a broader and principled view of things; most will realise that, for example, you can't have both no tax and acceptable public spending. Additionally, in a country as diverse as the UK, the odds of any single group holding sway are a little slim. If they do and if they have the support, then fair enough. Clearly we're not talking about micro management by referendum, but the big issues really should be up for everyone to have their say.

Mike.

earlier this month i did go down the route of trying to negotiate with a citroen dealer for a new car (never been done before but exceptional circumstances dictated). It was actually my parents who did the deed on our behalf as they are very well known to them and able to have a frank discussion.

we specified a car (one of the most popular of their range), including a few optional extras, and gave a price we would buy it at that day if the garage could agree. I was expecting some kind of re-negotiation but i was surprised at the response. maybe expecting the options to be thrown in with some of the discount - we initially asked for about -15%.

the dealers response was equally open. They can only sell the cars at what citroen allow them to and their margin was actually less than the discount we requested. Also the optional extras had to be bought (by them to citroen) at the costs quoted.

Now maybe there was an element of not telling us the complete truth, but the bottom line was he knew he would have a sale from us if the price was right. but he couldnt even enter discussion with us with any kind of sensible discount because its the money men in citroen uk that dictate the prices - and the offers are as quoted on the citroen website.

obviously negotiating for a particular pre-reg car on the forecourt would be different for the dealer but this excercise showed how the manufacturers operate in the uk.

the dealers have made money for the last years on finance schemes and after sales. Neither of which are any good to them now, what with reliabilty what it is and no finance being available.

and with companies no doubt cutting back on company car purchases / schemes i think we can expect a wholesale change in the way cars are sold in this country sometime soon.

i am sure most of the main dealers (not franchised units) are loss leaders paid for out of an advertising budget currently. Business rates for land have been relatively cheap after all.

From what I can see of our democracy in this country usually the general election system allows a small minority of the electorate to actually determine who will govern us. It is typically only a small number of constituencies that form the majority for the new government and of those winning MP's all will have very small majorities. Lets call it 50 borderline MP's with a typical win by 500 votes. In my book thats the future for the next 5 years for the 60 million of us decided by about 25,000 of us. If you then get to thinking about who actually makes up that 25,000 magic voters that really count you quickly realise what a crap system we have and why we are in such a mess today. Then you find you are in an even greater mess because you want a better, fairer political system but every option you think of (other than you as omnipotent head of state) has just as many drawbacks as the present system and a greater number of risks. When I was much younger I gave this subject a lot more though. These days I turn out and vote in all general elections as that is a responsibility placed on us by our wonderfull democracy, hope that my vote is for a loosing candidate or party so that in no way can I be responsible for the mess they are going to make then get on with real life.

John