Leak from diesel pump, refurbish or replace

[Rocketship X-M]

Please can an expert on this forum advise me what they would do in my situation?
My 2.1 td is leaking fuel from the Bosch diesel pump
The mechanic at my local garage says he can take it off and have it sent away for refurbishment
The company he recommends will not quote a price until they have seen it and another supplier says £600+VAT
Also is it worth having injectors changed/refurbished at the same time?

Any thoughts appreciated
Cheers

[xmexclusive]

Hi Rocket

The prices quoted are probably typical for the work described.
Has the car got sufficent residual life to justify that level of expenditure?
Do not get me wrong, I am not suggesting the car should be scrapped.
Just that the use of expensive new parts would be over the top in my book.
On injectors, a new set from Cit will cost you similar to the pump overhaul.
Refurb and test is usually around £100.
The key question though is does the car smoke heavily.
If not why touch the injectors at all.
For the pump it may just need new seals, depends where it is leaking.
This is a regular and easy job on Lucas pumps.
Well documented because it happens a lot.
Not so sure about the ease of new seals in a Bosch pump.
Has your pump been fed on Bio, veg oil or WVO instead of diesel?
Has a real bearing on likely condition of the pump internals.
At worst a good servicable secondhand pump should be obtainable for about £100.

I will try to get one of the pump experts to drop in here and give his opinion.

John

This post has been edited by xmexclusive on November 19, 2012 05:23 pm

[Rocketship X-M]

Hi John

Thanks for your speedy reply
Car is quite nice paid a fair bit for it from cit specialist after looking at a few mangy ones
Have kept it nice with regular service and cam belt and spheres
So don’t mind spending a bit on it but shouldn't go silly either as it is my daily drive rather than my pride and joy
"Good serviceable secondhand pump should be obtainable for about £100"
Sounds promising although mechanic did suggest this route but cautioned that you might get a another pump that’s not very good
Was only considering injector 'cos mechanic said his pump people did these too
And a mate said it could be the cause of rubbish fuel economy but then again so could a leaky pump
It only smokes a bit when cold so I guess they are not really bad
So my next question to xm club is where might I start looking for a good second hand pump?
Thanks again for any suggestions

[citroenxm]

Hi Rocketship,

The XM 2.1 Bosch Pump is a bit of a black area. Normally they are extreamilly robust pump but can give problems.

The issue is though, is the Bosch pump was only fitted for a short time in the XMs life. It wasn't fitted till around late 1991 to 1992 and was then only around for around four years till around 1996. The pumps are rather scarse now, finding one for £100 would be a stunningly good job!.

Is there certainly a Pump leak? Obvious place is the shaft seal behind the belt pully, this soaks the cam belt in fuel too weakening it, the only way to check is cover off the belt.. Ive not known other areas for leaks on the Bosch Pumps.

We do have another residant "Bosch Fuel Pump" expert who hopefully will pop his advice in later, and maybe confirm, but I have heard that the Xantia 1.9 TD Bosch Pump will do the same job with the Fueling turned up a little bit. But I dont think you will need to do this, as I think it will only need a front seal after its removed from the car.

Well well, ill be dammed... although off a Range Rover, this pump looks to be the same type with the front mounted advance as the XM has...

Jim, if you read this, what do you think? I understand I dont think you have ever seen an XM Bosch pump though..

This post has been edited by citroenxm on November 20, 2012 12:29 pm

[CitroJim]

Hi Rocketship, whilst we await the other expert Paul speaks of, here's my tuppence-worth...

QUOTE (citroenxm @ November 20, 2012 12:23 pm) 

Jim, if you read this, what do you think? I understand I dont think you have ever seen an XM Bosch pump though..

No, but I know they're very similar to the Xantia 1.9TD pumps Paul and the same applies to them.

Where is yours leaking from Rocketship? There are two main places and in both instances the pump must come off the engine to be re-sealed.

The two places are from the oil seal around the drive shaft at the front of the pump - this is just a normal looking oil seal and can be replaced without any further disassembly. The main place is up through the throttle spindle or around the lid seal, both of which needs the pump to be dismantled to effect a repair. The seal kits can be got quite cheaply and the job is within the scope of competent DIY.

Here's some good links to help you judge the job:

Firstly, a guide I wrote for the Xantia 1.9TD Here

And a very valuable thread on the other club-xm forum dealing specifically with a 2.1TD. Although the thread does not conclude the member did successfully do the job. You may have to join Club-XM.co.uk to read it... It is VERY long but good. Boch Pump Rebuild on Club-XM.co.uk

Hope that's good to start you off...

The high cost of doing the job professionally is because they will only do the job as a complete rebuild and calibration; it's not strictly necessary just to reseal but they won't just do that as they can offer no warranty.

[citroenxm]

Jim,

Did you look at my link to the RR VM Bosch Pump, they are IDENTICAL to those pumps!

PAul

[CitroJim]

The RR pump certainly looks similar Paul but it might be a bit different inside. They are specific to the engine they're intended to run on.

As the seller states it's been in storage for a while, I'd not trust it to just pop it on and off we go. Terrible things can happen to pumps that have been stored unused for a few years and that one does not look, erm, very clean and well-loved...

[CitroJim]

Oh and he's talking crap about the leak from the throttle spindle being an easy repair... It is indeed two O rings but it's a fair pump strip to fit them

[citroenxm]

So you think, either repair the current pump, or fit a Xantia Pump with adjusted fuel slightly Jim?

[CitroJim]

I'd advise repair the current pump Paul. The Xantia pump lacks the all important load lever on the side which is important if the car is an auto...

[citroenxm]

Tell me Jim, what does that water controlled lever on the pump do? They are fitted to manual cars too...

Why doesn't the Xantia Pump have it, if the XM does..

[Rocketship X-M]

Thanks for all the replies it has given plenty food for thought
Domestic disaster has occurred at chez Rocketship X-M so will have to chug about for a few more weeks wasting fuel

[robertmnorton]

Excuse my butting in, i believe it's the cold start advance. I had bother with lousey cold start which had me struggling for a week or two until i figured this out and freed up the seized shaft. The thermostat cable was operating ok just the lever wouldn't move.Once freed, instant starting resumed. I'd also noticed a slight fall in full load power until freed up.
robertm

[CitroJim]

That's it Robert. Mechanically realised rather than electrically on the Xantia pumps...

[citroenxm]

Ah.. i see...