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| peterh |
Posted: November 26, 2008 11:43 am
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Advanced Member ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 141 Member No.: 1424 Joined: November 15, 2008 |
Now that I, being a former DS- and CX-driver, yet having driven "normal" (read: "boring and bouncy") company cars for the last umphteen years, have joined the XM fold recently, it's time for some first impressions.
The XM at hand is a Continental-spec'd 2000 Berline 2.1 TD automatic. I would have liked a Series 1, but since this is going to be my daily transport, as well as our vacationing car*, I wanted an automatic, and a reliable, reasonably young one... and seeing reports everywhere about virtually all teething problems being taken care of in the last years of its existence, and seeing how virtually everyone is heaping praise on the 2.1 TD engine for its longevity and its reliability, it made sense to get this one. I was actually lucky to find and get it - previous sales had not materialised because the owner was out of the country a lot. Looked like it was just waiting for me to get it. What does it not have? Leather upholstery. I don't particularly like leather upholstery... sit on it in shorts after the car's been in the sun for a day and you know why ;-) Heated seats. I *hate* heated seats. Hate hate hate. It's only useful with leather seats anyway. A trip computer. This may be added in the future. Wobbly web alloys. These will be added in the near future. DIRAVI (bummer). Separator window. Radio. This will be added in the very near future. What does it have? Hydractive suspension (working fully and quickly) Electronic climate control (working fully and quickly) Cruise control Heated mirrors (only the driver mirror heating appears to work. Needs to be sorted) Central locking (broken on the left rear door - it only works at temperatures over 5 degrees Celcius or thereabouts... when colder, it's erratic. Needs to be sorted). How does my silver lady surprise me? All the buttons and dash lights are actually working. There are no undue warnings (failed ABS lights while ABS is in working condition, that sort of stuff). The auto box is actually quite good. It works differently from the 4 speed auto box in the Avensis that I had, but that's because this is a diesel, which has a narrower powerband than a petrol engine. Its gear changes (also on kickdown) are smooth and prompt. Contrary to reports I've read here and elsewhere, it acutally moves quite well from standstill. According to specs, it should do 0-60 in 12.5 seconds or thereabout. I haven't chrono'd it, but I would say that's fairly accurate. It warms up very quickly for a diesel. Compared to all company diesels I've driven (three), it's the fastest to get to normal operating temperature. This morning it was freezing, but within 3 miles, the temp gauge pointed at 70 degrees, and the interior had been warmed up nicely. How they do that is beyond me, but it's reassuring. Cold starts (as well as warm starts) are invariably, consistently excellent. It seems as if it's waiting impatiently for you to turn the ignition key. 'Come on already... start me! I want to run!" And dipped beam is actually quite good! I learnt recently that the headlights WERE upgraded at some stage in the late nineties, but only on left-hand driven cars. That probably explains it. How does it disappoint me? Well, comparing it to most cars, it doesn't. Comparing it to the CX, in quite a few respects. The CX (I had a 1981 CX, with the steel bumpers) was completely, patently bonkers. Out-of-this-world dash and controls, the lunatic spherical ashtray on top of the console, the stark-raving-mad DIRAVI steering, the hysterical brake operation... all of these features that scared the crap out of anyone used to normal cars, but delighted the Citroën-lover - and made the car a terrific driving machine. It was soooo easy to precisely control your braking action once you got your head around the principle that one toe would mean braking, two toes would be an emergency stop - and a foot on the brake would be the equivalent of running into a brick wall. The XM is a far more 'normal' car, with a normal dash, self-cancelling indicators, and normal (although still quite good) braking and steering. And of course, the CX had that suspension that completely isolated you from the road surface. The XM is definitely not as plush as the CX's suspension. But it's still a world apart from "normal" cars. And not just for the suspension. Each morning I arrive at work, and each afternoon I get home, the thought that the trip was too short is at the front of my mind. I still have to get that tank sufficiently empty to be able to say something about fuel economy. I've learnt to not rely on fuel gauges too much, but if, after almost 400 miles, the fuel gauge is still at 2/3, I think I will have to empty it a bit more and then top it up to get a more or less accurate figure. * Road tax in this country makes it prohibitively expensive to own a fleet of hobby cars. This car costs me 1300 euros a year in road tax... imagine having 5 of these! This post has been edited by peterh on November 26, 2008 11:45 am -------------------- ![]() 2000 XM Berline 2.1 TD Automatic |
| Andmcit |
Posted: November 26, 2008 11:58 am
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![]() Andre's Mate ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 2086 Member No.: 7 Joined: August 15, 2003 |
Indeed That's a real sh!t - can't believe something's actually better in the UK - that'll be a first!! Interesting reading Peter. Don't taunt us poor relations with RHD comedy dip beams!! Andrew |
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| colinxm |
Posted: November 26, 2008 08:41 pm
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![]() Super Member ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 415 Member No.: 100 Joined: December 02, 2004 |
Mine also is a Lhd with the supposedly improved front lights, they were still appalling until I fitted a 4300k HID kit (cheapo from Hong Kong), they are now fantastic ! so much so that the main beams now need a serious upgrade as they have hardly any impact whatsoever
Colin.P -------------------- Colin.P.
Jørpeland, Norway 1995 2.1TD silver estate, Rp 6723 1979 Triumph TR7 convertable 1998 Ford Puma (the wife's) 1989 Peugeot 205 cabriolet (the son's but I have to fix it...) 2004 Peugeot 307SW (another one for the missus) |
| jorgy9 |
Posted: November 27, 2008 10:13 am
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![]() Andre's Mate ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1248 Member No.: 318 Joined: February 05, 2006 |
wow!! 1300eu for a 2.100cc. Are you in Switzerland or something!? cheers G ps. btw, for the british moaners: UK road tax is cheaper than the Greek one!!! Only cars up to about 1,600cc are cheaper to tax in Greece. My 3lt would cost 550eu...! -------------------- XM '94 V6 12v, manual, Diravi - Mark "1.5" in black - bought: 138,000mls now: 167,000 miles
Axel '87 1.1 - real '70s Citroen handling (nope, it's not hydraulic!) My Flickr page I ...and II Is your XM as soft as it should be ?? ...Well, again: is it ??? Mine is not as good...but quite near! >>How I repaired my suspension part I ...and part II<< Kilmarnock -18mls south-west of Glasgow- |
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| peterh |
Posted: November 27, 2008 11:30 am
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Advanced Member ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 141 Member No.: 1424 Joined: November 15, 2008 |
In the Netherlands, road tax is not a function of engine capacity, but of weight, and diesels are taxed extra. But since diesel is less expensive than petrol, if your mileage is enough, the extra road tax is compensated by the lower fuel cost.
-------------------- ![]() 2000 XM Berline 2.1 TD Automatic |
| Citroenmad |
Posted: November 27, 2008 11:43 am
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![]() Double Chevron ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 844 Member No.: 1226 Joined: March 01, 2008 |
Very good read
Your road tax is shocking! The top road tax for a car in the UK is around £400 or something. I pay £35 a year for my Seat TDi, actually i think its £30 next year! -------------------- 1995 'N' XM 2.1TD VSX Manual Estate, magenta red - 62K miles
1998 'S' S1 Xantia Activa - silver 2006 '56' C5 2.0HDi 138 16v Hatch |
| peterh |
Posted: November 27, 2008 08:02 pm
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Advanced Member ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 141 Member No.: 1424 Joined: November 15, 2008 |
Yes, owning a car is prohibitively more expensive in this country than running it ;-)
I've found another thing wrong with the Silver Lady today... she had Marquant speakers in her front doors, the poor sweetheart! (If you don't know this brand: it's a rock-bottom-priced sticker brand that should be avoided like the plague. For faithful music reproduction, they're about as useful as a windshield wiper on a cow's arse.) These are now out. I don't know where they are, and I couldn't care less. I tried them for about 15 seconds before I knew enough. What a useless pile of dung. I got myself a kit of Macrom 16cm speakers and matching tweeters. That made a *huge* difference. Not only do they pack a punch, they also make Allan Holdsworth sound like Allan Holdsworth (and Gary Husband like the excellent drummer he really is). Which, for a car setup, is no mean feat. The other thing I noticed today is how ruddy quiet this 2.1 TD is. Until I had a radio in, the little fan in the roof for the temperature sensor that measures the in-car temperature was annoying - as was the wind noise that came from the wipers, even when at rest. Now that I can have music in my car, even when turned down to levels that will allow normal, non-voice-raised, conversation, both these annoyances disappear. Also, I am wondering if this XM has been chip-tuned or something. I find it fairly quick off the line, even though I keep reading comments like "a 2.1 TD auto won't move from standstill". Well.... mine moves, and fairly eagerly for such a heavy lump with only 110 BHP, I might add. One thing that is apparent now is that, while the Octavia 1.9 TDI that I drove from 2001 to 2005 may have been faster off the line, the same Octavia had this tendency of, when you'd floor it, respond as in "oh... so you would like to go faster? Wait a sec... I'll get back to you on that". When it did get back to you, the response was a huge kick in the back, but it definitely did lag behind, which can be unnerving. Not so with the big 2.1 TD Cit. Pedal down and it responds, without any lag. It's not a kick in the back, it's more like a big hand gives you a *huge* push. What you feel is what you get. And another thing: the turbo compressor seems to be very durable too. I cannot find any turbo compressor replacement or revision in the maintenance history... and yet, the turbo compressor is still inaudible - no high-pitch noise from the engine room whatsoever. After 200k miles, I would be ready to have that fixed, but it seems as if there is no reason to do so. Considering the fact that turbo compressor replacement in any VAG car (Audi, VW, Skoda, Seat) after 60k is nothing special, I find this astonishing. And then, of course, there is the unmatched ride quality. There is no single car manufactured in this century that matches this in terms of smoothness AND taut handling at the same time. No leaning in long fast curves, no incessant diving when braking hard -- and still offering this plushness. Who needs a Rolls when you can get this at a fraction of the price? And the 'Laufkultultur' of this wonderfully agile PSA diesel engine. And the intelligent auto box, that knows that, when the engine is not warmed up properly, it should behave differently to make it warm up quickly. Gawd, I really love this versatile, agile heffalump. I feel like I've succeeded... I have got the car I really want. This XM is all I want from a car, and more. This post has been edited by peterh on November 27, 2008 08:21 pm -------------------- ![]() 2000 XM Berline 2.1 TD Automatic |
| Andmcit |
Posted: November 27, 2008 09:25 pm
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![]() Andre's Mate ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 2086 Member No.: 7 Joined: August 15, 2003 |
Sounds great.
What you now need to compliment it, the 'yang' part to counter the 'ying', is an Activa!! Compliant smooth effortless ride but astonishing handling. The fantastic mpg you're getting would balance the sometimes silly mpg you'll get when going all out in the Xantia and yet the smaller car offers a matching ride/carrying capacity and roomy comfortable cabin. The Cx is softer mind and 'feels' smaller and more manageable than the Xm. I've done it again today - jumped straight out of the 24v v6 s1 and into the Cx Gti Turbo2... ...you know I don't think I'd miss the 24v if I stayed in the CX forever!! Andrew |
| peterh |
Posted: November 28, 2008 07:18 am
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Advanced Member ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 141 Member No.: 1424 Joined: November 15, 2008 |
Hmm, let me do some blasphemy. IF (not WHEN, but IF) I would be ready to pay road tax for another car, it would be the complete opposite: probably the (gasp) Mazda MX-5. I know... bland as the next rock, but in an unassuming way... and what a pleasure to drive. And I do think that, in order to really enjoy sporty driving (which doesn't mean "being as fast as possible", but much more "having as much fun as possible" without completely throwing safety out the window), mechanical suspension has its merits. In the MX-5, there is real feedback - your hands on the wheel -- and your bum -- can actually feel what the car is doing. And the MX-5 has a few qualities that other sports cars don't have. Not too much power, not too much grip... THE ideal car to have fun with on a curvy back road. Who needs Clarksonesque BHP's when you don't have your own track and drag strip, and you can't drift it at 50, because it sticks to the road like shit to a blanket? And... yes. Please please stop reminding me This post has been edited by peterh on November 28, 2008 07:24 am -------------------- ![]() 2000 XM Berline 2.1 TD Automatic |
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| DerekW |
Posted: November 28, 2008 06:41 pm
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Andre's Mate ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1320 Member No.: 173 Joined: June 01, 2005 |
So you intend to keep your XM then?
Derek -------------------- 1999 3.0V624v Exclusive Black! (RP8362)
2004 C3 Sensodrive Exclusive 1994 ZX Aura 1.8 auto Location: 5 miles North of Boston, Lincolnshire |
| Andmcit |
Posted: November 28, 2008 07:16 pm
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![]() Andre's Mate ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 2086 Member No.: 7 Joined: August 15, 2003 |
Oy! I didn't start talking about Cx's in this thread - you did Peter!!!
(in the first dozen words too). Ok, when I get started though.... I've driven some recent Mazda's and found the sharp handling and ride OK for the first 10 minutes but tiring and downright irritating for the remaining 2-3 hours. Guess I'm a big car person in that I don't feel safe in anything where my feet are about level with my waist or my backside less than a foot off the road! For a while I used to get a lift to work with a guy who ran a proper pukka Lotus7 and there wasn't even an attempt at weather protection on it; I'd get to work with a silly grin on my face but be in a total lather as if I'd just gone down a bobsleigh run 10/10th's. With the charge of adrenalin I'd be totally wired and no good for work until 4 coffees had been downed... was a nutter but I'd find myself volunteering for more! I'd liken it to being a bit like bungee jumping with a frayed chord!!!! Fantastic right up to the day that big lorry didn't see the small fast projectile appear under it's radar...!!!!! Andrew |
| jorgy9 |
Posted: November 29, 2008 03:13 am
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![]() Andre's Mate ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1248 Member No.: 318 Joined: February 05, 2006 |
That's why I drive with lights on all the time! You never know, they might save you at some point...(or help others save themselves from you!). BTW last weekend I rode (at the rear) of a 2006 Mazda 6 and was seriously surprised from its ride. Not only it is very taut in general, but also manages to transmit even the smaller bumps to the passenger. Tiiiiring! What's more serious though was the rear suspension's tendency to develop weird strong lateral forces when the car tackled various bumps/undulations, driving STRAIGHT on the motorway. This was a first for me: I'd never thought a car with independent suspension could simulate those scary moves my dad's Volvo 460 did (with a solid axis controlled by a Panhard bar). Speaking of progress...(weird, because I'd only read good things in the press about this Mazda's handling). cheers George -------------------- XM '94 V6 12v, manual, Diravi - Mark "1.5" in black - bought: 138,000mls now: 167,000 miles
Axel '87 1.1 - real '70s Citroen handling (nope, it's not hydraulic!) My Flickr page I ...and II Is your XM as soft as it should be ?? ...Well, again: is it ??? Mine is not as good...but quite near! >>How I repaired my suspension part I ...and part II<< Kilmarnock -18mls south-west of Glasgow- |
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| peterh |
Posted: November 29, 2008 07:23 am
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Advanced Member ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 141 Member No.: 1424 Joined: November 15, 2008 |
Yes, this is a keeper! -------------------- ![]() 2000 XM Berline 2.1 TD Automatic |
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| peterh |
Posted: November 29, 2008 07:26 am
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Advanced Member ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 141 Member No.: 1424 Joined: November 15, 2008 |
Compared to an XM, quite a few cars do that - steel suspension simply isn't quick enough to deal with small bumps AND provide taut handling at the same time. -------------------- ![]() 2000 XM Berline 2.1 TD Automatic |
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