30,000 Posts Today

Ref the yellowing diffusers, John (XMexcl) wrote about this recently I think. If I remember correctly his conclusion at the end of an exhaustive series of tests was that if you are using filament bulbs they reduce the light output but if you plan on fitting HID lights with their whiter light they don't - something to do with the colour spectrum.

Regarding the legality of HID lights, the EEC requirement is for self levelling and headlamp washers to be fitted. The XM has the first as standard and many also have the second so that's all right. The problem seems to be that although the light housings and lenses have EEC compliance and so do the HID fittings, they don't have compliance when fitted together because they have never been tested together.

However, many Forum members have fitted them and put them through the MOT successfully, my two included. In fact my V6 with both dip and main HID lights has now been through two MOTs.

If you decide to fit HID it is probably best to fit only to the dip beam, but I and I think everyone else who has them would say fit them. I promise you won't regret it.

Derek

Yep, the yellow looking diffuser that should be clear! Also remove the hood over the bulb, just grab the bottom where it slides in, with a pair of pliers and pull.

If you havn't removed the grill before, there are three screws along the top, one each side behind the sidelights, they can be removed by pressing on the lever that projects form the rear, if you look at the right hand one first it easier to see, and two self tappers at the underside ends of the centre slat.

The clips can be prised off the lamps quite easily with a small screwdriver, be careful not to loose them, if you insert a small screwdriver between the lens and housing, the rubber seal will usually let go without to much trouble. Dont forget to clean the inside of the glass as well.

Peter.N.

Sorry, forgot the bit about the alignment. Adjust them so that the far end of the dipped beam finishes about 30' in front of the car. The beam will be somewhat narrower than before, part of the reason for the increased brightness, but I have never had a problem with the MOT. If they are set to high people will flash you - they are that bright!

This post has been edited by Peter.N. on November 10, 2008 06:37 pm

Hi Citroenmad

I do not hold out much hope of you getting anything out of WHM other than fettled cars. They have never been willing to sell me any spare bits the couple of times I tried. I quite understand this as their profit is in the ability and expertise to present good XM's for resale and not to sell on the critical bits that everyone is short of. People who have bought one of their cars will get help but it is all part of the pricing structure. The supply of XM's is slowly drying up so their business will get just a little harder each year. Similarly I suspect that any one of the cars you pick out from the storage field to offer a bargin price for will be the next one to be rebuilt or a critical donor.

I realise now from reading your recent posts that you are looking for a very particular XM. Mk2 TD Estates with aircon are actually unusual. The standard VSX came without aircon for the 1995 and 1996 model years though a good number of 1995 showroom demonstrators were supplied with it. Apart from the demonstrators aircon was only available as a factory ordered extra cost option on VSX's as was cruise, leather and alloy wheels. All exclusives had aircon no RHD Mk2 exclusive Estates were built for the UK so that is cars only. From the 1997 model year on aircon became standard on the VSX Estate and continued to be fitted until Estate production ceased in 1999. But the numbers game comes into this as well. Citroen heavily over produced RHD XM's for the 1995/6 model years and build to registration date is typically well over a year suggesting that dealers were awash with unsold cars. So Citroen ramped right down XM production for the UK just when aircon became standard. Similarly dealers with unsold cars offered to get aircon fitted to get a sale with the earlier cars but this was usually done by local specialists and is a long way short of the integrated factory aircon installation.

From this you will see that many of 2.5 estates with factory aircon will be the early 1994 built ones now 15 years old with a fair usage history. Then even if you find one with aircon you need to check that it was a factory installation. The later 2.5 Estates are very thin on the ground and all of these are well sought after.

Like you I want 2.5 aircon Estates and have collected a few but am presently resigned to having to retrofit a couple of mine with bits recovered from life expired Exclusives. Not an easy option at all. There was a silver 2.5 estate with aircon on ebay recently. Had it been £250 cheaper and had 30k less on the clock I would have bought it now without viewing to save the effort of a retro-fit.

Hope this helps put your search into perspective.

John

THanks for the advice Derek, i think i may try do somehting with the headlights before trying the HID kit. My Xm being an SX doesnt have headlight washers, so i might try something with the headlights first.

Peter, So my yellow diffuser should be clear? This is interesting, as i was looking at pictures of when we got the Xm yesterday and i cant see any yellow in the headlights, do they just go like that over time?

I think ill give that a go, although a narrower beam of light doesnt sound too great. I supose i can easily fit the diffuser and bulb hood if i dont like the light pattern.

When do fog lights become driving lights? I was always under the impression that driving lights are not as bright as fogs, so its legal to use them? Does anyone use their Xms fog lights to aid lighting?

(FYI i dont use foglights, my Xm doesnt have them anyway, but they cant bee hard to fit!)

Hi John, thanks for the advice.

Im not sure what WHMs intentions are toward their Xms. Maybe the better ones they pull out, tidy and sell on. Its not easy to see how long each car has been their, all of them are covered in green algae which make them look like they have been there years. However its amasing how that stuff can build up, so it maybe that they have been stood only for months.

Some had obviously been there years, quite a sight to see really, although its a bit of a shame.

I didnt want to mention much about the estate i went to see, as i dont want a potential buyer or new owner coming on here and reading this. However under its boot carpet was soaking wet, and full of sand, round the boot floor looked rusty, small puddles under the rear seats and mould on the seats - i dont think a paddling pool in the boot of an Xm was ever on the options list! It was like it could have been in a flood at some point. The spheres all round were shot to pieces and looked as old as the car! However these would be done for the next owner. It did have recent strut tops though, but had been fitted with the very old hard spheres.

On inspecting the sills, one of the front jacking points had been torn off and there was damage of grounding on the sill too. The steering had a graunching noise to it - although this could be the acc sphere being totally flat. Both headlight washers needed replacing, the front bumper was cracked. With the water in the boot and the mould i feared the boot floor may be rotten, as it had obviously water in there for a while.

So that put us off right away and we did not bother checking its history or driving it. Although it is suposed to be very good and had a lot spent. Actually i should have checked its history, to see when its last service was, to see if its been on the road all the time of parked with its mates for a while! Although they said it had been traded in recently for a newer hatch XM. Just to say, the tiny picture of it on ebay, is not the one advertised.

Im not sure if we were too picky, but for £1300 id want a bit better car

The engine sounded nice, little whistle from the turbo but it sounded fine, the clutch felt and worked fine as did the gears.

I did ask about the spares, but it would seem they want to keep hold of them. Despite having many parts just lying around the cars, wheels, doors, bumpers, lights etc.

A fair few estates were 2.5s and some had air con. There were a couple which look to have been used for parts, but most were complete cars. A lot looked like they had been shipped in with small problems and had been pushed to one side.

Air con would be great, but it seens im asking too much, id settle for a 2.0 estate with no air con as long as it was in good condition. I can't have a tatty looking car, it has to look right, so that white estate it would cost a fair amount to get it right.

I quite understand buying a big 2.5 estate car with air con is difficult to find, especially one in reasonable condition. As they are mainly used for lots of high miles, heavy loads in the back and may get neglected along the way.

Likewise i know mileage is not an issue on these, as long as they have been lookd after and they are well cared for thats fine.

Interesting, i had thought they did not make any exclusive estates (though they did do a v6 exclusive estate?), i have seen a few estates bearing the exclusive badges and leather interior though, must just be options?

Chris

This post has been edited by Citroenmad on November 10, 2008 11:29 pm

Hi Chris

Yes the diffusers do yellow with age and probably UV light. Dont be at all concerned about the narrower beam, the increase in light output more than makes up for it, I dont think you will be wanting to refit your diffuser.

Re the fog lights - the answer is I don't know, what I do know though, is that a friend of mine was recently fined for driving with them on a clear night.

Peter.

Rear fog lights is only the start of it.

I think the Waynes, Barry's and Dwane's in small Renaults and Jap efforts etc should be more
than fined for driving everywhere with the front idiot lights on...

What is it with thease people, are they afraid of the dark or something? Their cars are usually hardly
capable of driving quickly so it can't have anything to do with reading the road a long way ahead...

Andrew

True, ill stay clear of them, it would be nice to fill in a black on my SXs dash with a fog botton though

Side tracking (i should stop!) what is the other spare black for on the S2 dash? Cruise control activation button?

Taking out the diffuser is definitely something im going to try

Yes! It says here in the handbook;

"Control switches:

• Blind everyone coming the other way lamps
• Dazzle everyone behind and prevent them seeing you're braking lamps
• Heated rear window
• I realise whilst I get my fags I'm double parked and am causing a hazard lamps
• Interior lighting
• Cruise control
• Alarm and alarm LED
• Temperature sensor"

Thing with Citroen has always been the toppest bestest of the range models will come with
blanks too just in case the base model may have need for more switches...

The handbook goes on to say

"Do not position your foot under the accelerator pedal while the cruise control is in operation.
Your reactions may be impeded and movement of your foot restricted"

Damn, that's what I've been doing wrong all these years!

Andrew

This post has been edited by Andmcit on November 11, 2008 02:09 am

I thought so, my SX only has two blanking places, so thats the dazzel lights and the cruise.

I often put both my feet under all the pedals when im using the cruise (on my other car), its comfortable but probably not very safe

Chris wrote "When do fog lights become driving lights? I was always under the impression that driving lights are not as bright as fogs, so its legal to use them? Does anyone use their Xms fog lights to aid lighting?"

The law is quite clear on this subject. Any light with its centre less that two feet above the road may only be used in fog or falling snow. As the centres of all foglights are below 2ft their use in clear, or even rainy, conditions is illegal.

I don't know why so many people use their fogs in normal driving unless they are announcing to the world that they have a higher spec car!

There was a time when the Police would come down like the proverbial ton of bricks on any lighting transgression, but nowadays they rarely bother - as in riding bikes on the pavement or discarding fast food packaging anywhere but in the bin. It's probably too much hassle for them to fill out the paperwork.

Derek
.

Re-reading my last post, it seems to me that the problem is that lots of people are unaware of the law with respect to foglights. Although it's a long-standing regulation, its contents have not been promulgated. Still, I suppose it gives Authority the chance to do you if they see fit. Although with the number of people around who use them as driving lights it seems that Peter's friend is an exception.

I read somewhere that the current bunch of legislators have introduced an average of 3.000 new laws a year since they came to power. This puts us in a dodgy position as it seems that every activity we are likely to indulge in is controlled by at least one law. Are we supposed to check the statute books before we use any piece of equipment?

1984 was a bit late coming, but....

The rant is not over, this is just the latest installment!

Derek

This post has been edited by DerekW on November 11, 2008 06:16 pm

Good information, i wont bother fitting them

Just to emphasis, i have never used front foglights in normal conditions.

Or foggy conditions for that matter, as my car doesnt have them!

Hi all,

Looks like XMexc's post got hijacked by the lighting discussion.

In any case, 30,000 posts and over 1000 members is a tremendous achievement. Thanks to all who read and contribute to club-xm. Without the readership and contributions from avid members club-xm would not be the premiere source on the whole WWW for XM information that it is.

Congratulations to one and all for an extremely successful mutual partnership. Long may it continue.

Cheers

noz

ps
Lets keep the lighting discussions to the electrical section. Ta.

By God, but there's been some digressing lately!!
The 'entertainment' is like one long rollercoaster ride that just keeps running!
Thanks everyone!! And Noz who's wearing the driver's cap too!

Andrew