A Bad Case Of Citroenitis! ;-)

As seen on Cx Club forum:

OOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooo

Very VERY nice!!

For some reason in the past, a lot of people seem to have had a bad vibe about owning
a green car. Never worked that out as Britain is always associated with racing BRG!

Andrew

This post has been edited by Andmcit on January 17, 2008 12:40 am

Thanks for the pics Andrew,
surprised to hear that you drive it regularly, I thought it was a show car.......are you sure you didn't just scan the pics from an old Citroen brochure
I don't think your fave pic really captures the brilliant white of the paintwork.
I like the sc-fi interior of the green one, even though the facia panel is a complete waste of usable space. I'd forgotten just how extreme Citroen styling used to be.

The thing about the early dash is the feeling of a massive open space ahead of you that
emphasises the size of the windscreen even more. On the continent there used to be a
scultpted tray that could sit on the top where you could probably watch the coins roll to
and fro on!!

In shame I must admit if you look closely at the front picture of TTX I've managed to pick
up a smashed fog light which I hadn't noticed until after the picture had been taken.
To compound matters, I found a replacement which are almost impossible to find, and
have managed to put it somewhere in the garage and it hasn't been seen for months.

It is used daily in some cases for whole months on end, but it's resting at the moment
whilst that hard salt/grit chucked about in such massive volumes by the council about
these parts in the past few weeks is present; would probably dissolve the car before I
got it back home!! Shame they never galved the last s2's as a practice for the Xm.

I wish!!

I really am getting withdrawal symptoms from the self imposed exile that is Xantia driving!!
(can't bear such treatment for the Xm's too as I can get a bit paranoid).

Andrew

This post has been edited by Andmcit on January 17, 2008 01:42 am

It's the particular viewpoint of the car, not necessarily THIS exact picture.
Here, another pic:

It's the just-about-to-launch off into the distance shot!!



(damned birds...)

and more on topic:



Andrew

This post has been edited by Andmcit on January 17, 2008 01:51 am

Andrew - just a question - do you live in a bloody big field?

I was thinking the same thing but didn't like to ask

No, but like my cars - I'm all over the place!!

Andrew

Nice fleet!

I've just got to ask, how does the ride and handling compare to a XM and how's the 2.5 diesel compare to the XMs?

Thanks.

Steve.

Andrew,

Which CX variety do you prefer? Series 1 or 2?

Series 1 is my preference. I love the dash, and the instrument panel with the rotating drums, superb. (attached is a pic for those who are unfamiliar). And the stainless steel bumpers make them look much classier in my opinion.
Nice collection of cars btw!

You'll get me into trouble. I'm very likely to get thrown off this forum if I answer honestly
these leading questions you guys are asking!!

We're really into the realms of personal taste/expectations and that woolly area of individual
subjectivity. Sure the Xm is a car clearly designed and manufactured years on from where
things really finished with the Cx and it IS better built, and has been made with a good many
notches up the scale of bulid quality. As Clarkson would say, an Xm door will gently thump
shut like a shot pheasant hitting the ground, whereas a Cx door closes with a clatter like a
metal bin lid being dropped. In this respect the Xm is a clear winner.

In a head v's heart trade off the Xm wins.

BUT, as we all know with Citroens, the heart has quite a good time ruling the roost and I'd
go for the dear old Cx EVERY TIME. I've owned/tried almost every permutation of Cx both
diesel and petrol and really the only hassle would be the VERY difficult call to make between
a s1 and s2 although it may just edge towards the S1!

More specifically the S1 GTi Turbo1!!

For looks and purity in the overall design Citroen-ness I'd say the s1 is the best, and in
the guise of the Turbo1 it got to the ultimate development of the s1 (either the GTi or the
Prestige Turbo1!!). Most of the rust issues were better resolved and basically the engine
remained the same in principle then to the end of the series GTi Turbo2. Sure there are
obvious changes on the s2 and that's why I'm torn with liking them just as much.

Certainly it visually got more butch with the deeper bumpers and sill trims and the
modernisation of the s2 dash is very successfull being striking and visually effective in a
different way to the early design. There were streamlined changes and cost cuts in some of
the fixtures and fittings that were hidden from view but the feel remained the same though
the big marshmallow seats were swapped for firmer more shaped but still comfortable one's.

The ride has always been best on all but the highest spec GTi models, the estates being
truly superb for their ability and stability. In fact, in motorway crosswinds I've found the Xm's
a bit unnerving and a bit skittish, whereas the Cx seemingly won't budge off it's selected
path probably even in a hurricane!!

For ride comfort the Cx Gti's are noticeably firmer (certainly not as floaty as other Cx's) but
the ride isn't uncomfortable - in fact I'd go so far as to say the Cx GTi is a match to the more
complex Xm set up - the GTi being tauter in body roll to match the Xm where the other Cx's
will roll a bit more.

There ISN'T a better Estate than a Cx Safari/Familiale and that is very much taking into account
the Xm who's rear axle wasn't pushed back to lengthen the wheelbase like the Cx no matter how
useful the newer car's more upright sides are - the Cx estate has a more vertical tailgate which
directly allows a longer big load (possibly narrower though!!).

As far a different diesels are concerned to actually drive I'd say there isn't really a winner
or loser in the comparison - the Cx DTR2 is a fabulous if historically flawed engine that will
gallop effortlessly across whole countries on the motorway all day long at 80-90 and still return
a handsome mpg in the mid/high 40's and it's certainly no slouch either - the opposite is true
from the surprised looks of those around me when the mood takes to give it a full head of steam
and this 'bloody great huge thing' zaps past!!

The GTi engined TRi manual estate is a real wolf in sheep's clothing and can be driven in a
manner that belies it's sheer size. You just feel 'planted' in all the corners in a similar way
to a GS!!

I appreciate the positive comments from everyone on the cars pictured. I guess I must find
the Cx's more photogenic judging by the number of Xm pictures I've found on the computer!!
Don't get me wrong, I love my Xm's, as the stupid number of them with an uncanny bias
towards V6's will testify.

Quite frankly if Citroen had pulled their finger out and galvanised the Cx in the car's later years
I think most of us here would be driving one of them as opposed to an Xm!!

All the best,
Andrew

This post has been edited by Andmcit on January 18, 2008 12:01 am

Hi Andrew

Mrs V6 sadist here (and it's my V6 actually if he looks at the V5). It's sad but true that I have also been caught drooling over your white CX beauty. Even I could be tempted to fill the empty space on the drive with a CX. V. impressed.

Debbie

Love the pictures at Bamburgh.

Hi Andrew,

Thanks for the detailed reply. This is pretty much how I moved to the XM from a Xantia.

They are very tempting, maybe if a nice diesel came along....

Must find out more about the CXs diesel engine.

Steve.

Some, not all of the Diesel engines have issues!!

Sadly the best is the one with the history of problems but if you're prepared for them
you won't be disappointed. Without going into the WHOLE history of Cx engines there
are really only 2 of recent times that will still be around anyway, the DTR Turbo and
the DTR Turbo2. The DTR2 had a different set of gearbox ratios and an intercooler
which helps make the diesel Cx a real flying machine in an identical manner to the
petrol Cx Turbo and Turbo2 equivalents.

On the DTR2 the bhp went from 98 ota to 128 which is actually quite a big deal on a
big 4 pot torquey engine. The intercooler and different turbo really suit the Cx well
and make a comfortable flexible but heavy car more manageable on the wallet!!

Just to point out perhaps the obvious!
The engine is basically a dieseled version of the petrol 2.5 and doesn't use sleeves
for the bores, has pushrod operated valves (two per cylinder) by a belt driven cambelt
as is the diesel pump. None of this multi valve busness found on the later Xm.

The issues?

Well, basically the consensus seems to believe the block is not even worth being made
into a doorstop or garden ornament and that it'll screw the water system up and you'll
be changing head gaskets aevery 6 months.

Ok, that's as maybe, but in my personal experience the head has ALWAYS been the
villain of the piece with several cars now fettled to work happily to big mileages still
running on their original bottom ends. I think Citroen saw a real dent in their brand
reputation looming and as the sales figures for the Cx weren't exactly massive it was
probably easy to make a widespread call to dealers to just stop any issue snowballing
into something nasty and change the whole engine without really looking that closely
at the 'broken' engines.

The real issue is a crack in the cast galleries in the cylinder head on no1 cylinder
between the inlet/exhaust valves that runs right up into the top of the head. I've seen
6 at a CCC rally and only one didn't have the crack so I bought it and the car has been
faultless ever since.

OK, this is all just from my personal experience but in 4 cases a new head solved the
problems of recurring HG failures...

same bottom ends remained in place every time!!

The reason this may all actually kick off in the first place is the cooling system is a bit
convoluted and prone to heater matrix issues which can very quickly/easily trip up the
cooling circuit.

On buying any CX diesel I'd be more interested in the health of the whole cooling circuit
as a top priority concentrating on the water pump and it's bridging casting mounting
between it and the head, the thermostat and the heater matrix. There's a header tank
and a breather bottle to watch too.

In reality the diesel bits are nice and straightforward and you just need to watch the
glowplugs and the electrically triggered plunger for the fuel cut off that can go a bit wobbly
now and then but these aren't big bucks and are on ebay if you look. The pumps and
injectors have seldom given me any grief in over 15 years.

What else?
Well engine mounts, exhaust braided front flexible, starters and alternators are probably
the only other things to think about.

The oil filter is fabulous to change pointing upwards at you from a remote oil/water heat
exchanger at the top back of the engine and a pleasure to do, unlike the faff of the petrol
oil filter position (don't go there; well you can't really, even if you want to!!)

Hope this helps fill in some gaps for you.

All the best,
Andrew

My first Cx GTi Turbo1 with it's sister at a CCC rally just a few years back.



For me, still the best! Only a small wrinckle on one front wing and bubbles around the sunroof
requiring attention! Currently safely warm and dry stored away awaiting action; not long
if plans made actually work out in the near future.

Andrew

I love this picture; that road is such an enticement rolling off into the distance with that
amazing skyline in the far distance. It's such a fantastic place and I do get quite homesick
seeing it and other pics of Northumberland!

With that Cx sitting waiting and ready to blast off it's where I'd like to be right now.
I still can't work out why I'm sitting here in South Wales = warmer but bloody wetter!

Andrew