Driver Electric Window Kaput!

[Peter.N.]

Hi George

Well, that should be proof enough, maybe your meter doesn't have a very low ohms range. I have a sunroof motor here which also reads zero ohms, but when you connect that to the battery, the wires turn red hot in your fingers!

Peter.N.

[xmexclusive]

Hi George

Test bits in the post this afternoon.

Regards

XMexc

[jorgy9]

Hi John, thanks.

Just tested the bits: now BOTH Bitrons (and switches) are working! I can't explain. Bad contact that cured with car being driven around? I first tried the replacement Bitron. Is it possible this has "unstuck" something? Although window motor has worked with feed from the battery.

One thing is common with all bits combinations (Bitrons+switches): there's still the exact same "click" from the Bitron when operating the switch, any button, any direction. I'm 100% that this click was not there before. It is obviously the relay in the Bitron, but why does it do it now?

The stupid thing is I can't try it and see for, say, a forthnight, because I'd have to put the trim back on the door to operate the swithces! Only thing is to be trying the bits on every couple of days to see for intermittence.

Can anybody confirm their Bitron is clicking/not clicking when they operate the one-touch switch? Please put your ear near the lower side of the door trim as the noise might be covered by the motor moving the window (only thing I can think of as to why I've never heard this "click" in the past).

George

[xmexclusive]

Hi George

Sounds like a cheap fix. Hang on to the bits for a while just in case it goes again. I cannot do your click noise test because my Mk2's are not fitted with the Bitron box. Is it possible the trim has lost grip on some of the press clips so the noise from the relay is heard in the car now?

Regards

XMexc

This post has been edited by xmexclusive on May 25, 2007 07:30 pm

[Peter.N.]

......or it may be that when the window is working you can't hear it.

Peter.N.

[jorgy9]

Hi guys,

no, I'm sure this noise was not there before. The first time I heard it was exactly when the switch stopped working -so trim firmly on door-. It is identical whether trim is on or off, it's *that* loud.

Generally, is there any reason why a relay would make such an audible click?

thanks
G

[jorgy9]

ps. it clicks only *once*, st the moment the electrical contact is made.

[Ciaran]

Afternoon guys,

I know this is a blast from the past, but I thought some additional information might be useful to a future XM window victim.

Yesterday, I finally got around to fitting the replacement doorcards (kindly sent by XmExc), into Thunderbird 2.
Anyway, while I had the driver's trim off, I decided now was the time to have a look at this non-working window issue once and for all.

For some reason, even though this is an S2, it has a bitron box! I noticed that when operating the one touch switch, the bitron could be heard to click faintly.
I went and extracted the spare box from the driver's doorcard of the scrap S1 I got my leather interior from.
I plugged the replacement bitron into the S2, pressed the button. <Click>..... nothing. Damn I thought, the issue must be the wiring / motor then. I was about to break out the fly leads and put 12v across the motor, when I managed to accidentially press the window switch while wiggling and unplugging it. Suddenly, <Wrrrrrrrrrrrrrr>... I look up, and the window is going down!
Ecstatic, as this is the first time its ever opened since I bought the car, I tried to close it again. <Click>from bitron box, then...nothing.
Oh shit I thought, is the motor dodgy and now the window is stuck in the open position... and that looks like (more) rainclouds on the horizion!
I couldn't understand why it was now failing to close, given that the switch was a known working one... or was it. I could have sworn I'd tested that switch previously and found it to be ok. Just on a hunch I went and extracted the definately working switch from the other XM, and plugged it in.
The result? window now opens and closes properly!

Just on the off chance that it had been dodgy switches the whole time, I plugged the original bitron back in and tried it. <click>....nothing.

So then, its quite possible to have a faulty bitron box and switch at the same time, something to watch out for, as it will definately send you on a nice detour off some cliffs when it comes to fault finding.
I guess the moral of the story is never assume anything, as not only does it make an ass of u and me, this is XM electrics we're talking about!

Hope this is helpful to someone in the same predicament.

Cheers

Ciarán

This post has been edited by Ciaran on July 23, 2007 06:04 pm

[Peter.N.]

Hi Ciaran

Very satisfying when you find something like that! Most of the XM switches are notoriously unreliable, so always double check, they are also intermittent, which confuses things even further. You can even replace it with another faulty one

The seat reclining switch packed up in mine when I was out in the car and had the seat fairly well reclined! after fiddling about with it for about 5 minutes, it fortunatly, decided to work again. The same thing happened to my sunroof a few weeks ago, I thought the roof had packed up, as they very often do, but no, it was the switch again.

Hope it doesn't give you any more trouble.

Peter.N.

[Ciaran]

Hi Peter,

Yes, it was very satisfying to find it was such a simple problem after all this time. The neighbours must think I'm a nutcase, but then they probably think that already
Its just good to get a pleasent surprise sometimes instead of a nasty one...

It sounds ridiculious, but I've not had a chance this past year to look at it properly, wish I'd tried ages ago though. TBH I was expecting it to be the motor or cable, so was putting it off and off for a run of good weather, as I thought it was going to be a long job. Just shows you, check the simple things first.

Funny you should mention it, my S1 sunroof also had (and regularly redevelops) the switch issue that you had. I find when it takes one of it's moods, I can get it to close by gently 'dabbing' the button repeatedly, not pressing it all the way in. Obviously a dodgy contact.

I was thinking of replacing the switch with the one from the scrapped S1, but whos to say how reliable that one will be, given the window switch that was in the S2 came from there, and I thought it worked!

I guess the smarter option would be to dismantle and clean the spare switch, then fit it. One of these days....

Typical about your seat one, I'm sure you had visions of having to fiddle about with a paperclip or length of wire in the multiplug just to get it raised for the drive home, I bet manys an XM driver has had to do that at one point or another...

Cheers

Ciarán

This post has been edited by Ciaran on July 23, 2007 09:39 pm

[DerekW]

"There is a black plastic light shield and the presence/lack of the control box behind and slightly above this is easily determined."

So that's the piece of 4" square black plastic that I had left over after doing my window!

It joins the square white plastic bit with two stiffening ribs, about the same size, that was left over when I did the instruments on the estate.

Derek

[Peter.N.]

Hi Ciaran

The seat switch went on one of my Mk1s when I was in Plymouth and refused to function, I eventually had to take the one from the other seat to get it back upright. Yes, I have also found that 'dabbing' the switch makes it work. If anyone was watching us.....

Peter.N.

[xmexclusive]

Hi Peter and Ciaran

I just take the switches out when they get iffy and give them a good spray with switch contact cleaner and put them back. Never fails, must be because like all good XM's they are better with a bit of attention.

Hi Derek

Probably very sensible to leave it out. I cannot see any technical or functional need that the black plastic serves. I just put it down to design by a frenchman.

Regards

XMexc

[jorgy9]

Hi Ciaran,

does the Bitron continue clicking now u've fixed the thing? Mine does (loudly), while I think it was not in the past.

regards
George

[Ciaran]

Evening guys,

Peter, all that messing about with seats up and down must have looked funny from a distance!

XmExc and Derek, the only thing I can say about the plastic light shield, is yesterday when I had the door card off, but all the gubbins still connected to the car, I noticed that the kerb light was getting really hot to the touch on the outside of the card, so I imagine inside was similar. Perhaps the shield is to protect the bitron box, and combustible materials on the inside of the door?

Either that, or to prevent the light escaping out other crevicesand looking bad. Really can't guess as to it's purpose other than those two possibilities though. I think Dereks right, its just French design

George, yes, when the door was still apart, the spare, working bitron could be heard to click whenever the window started and stopped moving, it was louder than previously. I'm guessing theres just an internal relay operating. Does make me wonder what the fault with the original unit is, because it's relay does click...

One thing I forgot to mention, the drivers window only, is live all the time, regardless of ignition on or off, doors locked or unlocked. Surely this isn't normal behaviour?

Cheers

Ciarán