Window Motors

[Ciaran]

Morning guys.

Does anyone happen to know if the electric window motors are fed by a relay, or is it just direct via the fuse?
My front passenger side window suddenly stopped working last night. No broken cables, no graunching from the motor, just nothing. I've had the body - door connector off and thoroughly cleaned all the contacts etc. The switches in both driver and passenger door seem fine, and all 3 fuses related to windows (9,26, and 35 if memory serves) aren't blown.
I was wondering if there was a relay or something on the motor which could be at fault. I've never heard of a motor itself dying, but then again theres a first time for everything!

Any thoughts appreciated.

Cheers

[Peter.N.]

Hi Ciaran

Are you sure that the switches or OK, it seems to be the first thing to check with any XM electrical fault, they seem to be inherently unreliable. You have probably tried swapping driver/passenger switches, unless of course you have the 'one touch' type on the drivers side. Have you checked to see that there is actually voltage across the motor when the switch is operated? if there is, it must be a problem with the motor. I have never had one fail, but as you say 'there's always a first time'. I wonder if they have an overload/over temperature cut out?

Peter.N.

[Ciaran]

Hiya Peter,

I have the one touch function on the driver's window only, so in theory I could try swapping the pasenger switch from the driver's door into the passenger door.
I haven't yet done this, but instead had the switches out on both sides and thoroughly wirebrushed their contacts (had this problem in my old S1, and that fixed it). I thought it highly unlikely that both switches would fail at the same time, as they were both working fine up until the failure, however this being an XM, I really should know better, and stop being so naive!

Are the back door switches the same as the passenger one? I know they work for sure, so could try putting one in later on.

Many thanks

Ciarán

This post has been edited by Ciaran on May 03, 2007 11:52 am

[onthecut]

Hi Ciaran.

If no luck with switches etc., you need to have a look at the harness between the post and the door. Constant door use definitely produces breakages in the cables there.

Mike.

[xmexclusive]

Hi Ciaran

The passenger window switches are wired in series not parallel so both have to be working. The back door switches are the same so can be swapped to test out for switch failure. There is a relay No. 810 that supplies all windows so if others work then it is not the relay. I have a set of flying battery leads and a recovered window motor plug that I use for testing motors and setting them to position for recovery/repair of bits. Just reverse the battery polarity to go the other way.

Regards

XMexc

[Ciaran]

Hi Mike, XmExc.

Well I had a quick go this afternoon, and was surprised to find that the rear switches in fact don't fit the front plugs, they have different sized locating tabs. Oddly though, the front switches plugged into the rear fine, having wider tabs on them.

Not to worry though, I remembered I had a couple of known good switches from that S1 I got the leather interior from, so plugged those in. The bad news is that theres still no go. I'm going to try the fly lead method if I get a chance tomorrow, and see if its the motor or body-door wiring harness.
I must say, the switches being wired in series is a bit of a gotcha, I never would have thought of that... sadly it didn't turn out to be so easy, but still, handy information to know

One working window out of four, and a dodgy alternator, it never rains but it pours!
Still, will get it all sorted over the next few weeks.


Thanks for the suggestions, much appreciated

This post has been edited by Ciaran on May 03, 2007 06:58 pm

[xmexclusive]

Hi Ciaran

Sorry to give duff info on the interchangability of the back switches. Did the front switches work ok when plugged in the back windows? That should check them. There is no difference in the connector wiring of the switch plugs it is just that front passenger switches have a illumination lamp wired in them and the back ones lack the lamp. The feeds to the winder motors are at the outer ends of the 5 pin switch plug (pins 1 & 5) so you could insert the battery flying leads there to test the motor drive. It seems from the wiring diagram in Haynes that there are 2 relays, one for front and the other for rear winders. The typical wiring also shows that the feeds go first to the drivers side switch then the passenger one. With the drivers side switch removed you should see a clear EARTH on pins 2 & 4 and 12volts on pin 3. Then with the passenger switch removed there should also be 12volts on pin 3 of that plug. The 2 wires between these switches go from D1 to P2 and from D5 to P4. If you can check these for continuity with a meter then that is all the winder wiring through the door hinge checked.

Regards

XMexc

[Ciaran]

Hi XmExc,

You didn't give duff info at all, I believe my car may have just had different switches for some reason. I rechecked my spare S1 switches, and it looks like someone has snapped the plastic tabs off them at the corners to make them fit into another plug!

Many thanks for the info on testing the continuity of the door wiring. It can be the first outing for the multimeter I bought cheap a few months ago. Not used one properly before mind you, so must do some reading up on it, lest I should fry something

I had planned to get this all checked over the weekend, but I ended up helping my dad cut down a few trees, and have injured my back pretty good in the process! So, it may be a fair few days before I can get looking at the cars again, but will post up any progress anyway, should it benefit anyone else trying to diagnose a similar problem.

Cheers again!

Ciarán