Do I Scrap My K Reg Xm 2.0i Presteige?

[DrTim]

I've had it for over 9 years now. I'm finding it very hard to let go but people keep telling me to drive it to the scapyard!

I ain't got much money to spend (problem I know, I've managed to keep it running thru some hard times, slightly better now but not much) and nowhere to work on it offroad, some very nice ciitroen specialists have been working on it since 2000, before that dealer, I am third owner, first owner did 80k in 2 years, 2nd was lady but I have no service history prior to '98, all MOT#'s though, it had 114k on it when I got it.

Petrol 2.0i almost 160k. Lots of new bits over the years. New spheres 95, recon steering rack 2001, starter motor '99, new front pads and discs 2006, new alternator 2005 (starts better now than even!) plenty of exhaust bits relatively recently etc etc. However even the local Citroen specialists who've been working on it since 2000 are shaking their heads with the latest saga.

I had bad coolant leak Nov thru early Jan, carried on driving it (totally skint), filling up with water daily or more (driving round town).

Eventually had water pump replaced, cams too obviously, but due to availability and cost issues still got the old cam pretensioner on it. Advised bottom hose near end of life and a new LHM leak (it has been using about a litre a month since 2002ish). Put water back in to test, large bubbles in coolant when warming up. Advised this is probably head gasket going. Also advised hydraulic pump could be failing.

Also rear brakes and discs shot so sat on problem.

Discovered K-seal, tried it, seems to have stopped large bubbles, some frothing but apparently this can be due to running on water not coolant.

MY current dilema, should I get rear brakes sorted so I can drive it some more to test the long term effect of the K-seal. I ran around for about 4 miles today twice, still goes OK, needs driving really, water does get a bit frothy. Reluctant to drive it more with rear brakes grinding. I have to give back what I have been driving recently before easter, so need to make decision soon.

There are plenty of other probs, no ns wing mirror (I have replacement to fit from Ebay though), rear ns window won't go all the way up, radio died in Dec, backlight for clock/temp display went in Dec, rear o/s bumper missing trim and slightly crackedfrom rear end collision while parked in jan (effects looks not functionality), have had very rare intermittent ABS warning over the years, so I'm worried about the electrics.

If I could get a cheapish newer XM locally I might go for that, I guess, but realistically my other option is a 500 quid Xanthia. I do like the XM with all its drawbacks and I would hate to loose the option of filling one up with stuff, the extra width is great for guitar cases, and its so spacious. Mine is leather without electricseats and a/c is probably shot as should have been regassed in 2002.

Its a shame these cars are worth so little. Most of the bodywork thats been done on mine over the years is not my fault and caused while parked.

Any comments or advice would be much appreciated. Previous attempts to track down a resource like this site have failed, but I'm here now.

regards

[Peter.N.]

Hi Dr Tim

Welcome to the club. I am afraid you have the same dilemma as many others, hence all the XMs on ebay! They can be an expensive car to keep running, and unless you are getting a lot of use from them, sometimes uneconomic, which is a shame because they are a superb car.

I have spent money on mine, but as I am doing about 20k miles a year in it, its worthwhile, especially as I am getting 40-50mpg. What other car of that size, even a modern one can better that, it is diesel of course. What you have to ask yourself is, what am I going to replace it with and how much is it going to cost me? It could well be worth spending some more on yours, at least its a known quantity. But I am afraid its your decision.

Many XM owners are DIYers, that's the only economic way to keep one running really.

Peter.N.

[demag]

Dare I say welcome to the forum DrTim.

Most of our motors have a list of problems to work through. There aren't all that many on here that are dead straight.

I wouldn't go rushing to the scrappies just yet. Some of the members on here are VERY knowledgeable, especially on S1 cars.

Wait for some replies off the experts and then decide. There are some very resourceful people here. Plus members do have spare parts available or links to alternative suppliers.

You're home now. Take a deep breath and relaaaax

[DrTim]

Thanks for the initial replies, I'm impressed to get two within 90 mins of posting!

Sure I prefer the "devil you know", I'm ready I guess to spend a few hundred on it but the best part of a grand to get the head gasket done and all the other bits, not so sure.
Hydraulic pumps are expensive apparently and head gasket job seems unrealistic so any advice on diagnosing those more cleary would be most appreciated.

regards

[Peter.N.]

Hydraulic pumps are about £160.00 but you should get a reasonable one from the scrappie, are you sure its faulty? Head gasket, now that's a different kettle of fish. Mine was going to be about £1k so I did it myself, a pig of a job but well worth doing. I would have thought it would have been easier on a petrol engine because it does actually say in the haynes manual that you can get the head off with the engine in the car, unlike the 2.1 diesel, you can, but what a job!

Peter.N.

[xmexclusive]

Hi Dr Tim

Welcome, sorry to hear that your much loved XM has the odd problem. Peter is right that only you can decide its future but it might be worth looking at making it limp on until there is a definite answer about the head gasket. If I have understood fully the two things of immediate concern are the rear brakes and is the head gasket going. If these can be sorted/fixed for now cheaply and there is time until the next MoT/road tax it might be worth running the car to be certain the head gasket is ok. The comment that the bubbling may be due to water instead of coolant is worth following up. There are simple suction/float gauges that will make a quick check on the current strength of the antifreeze. The alternative is to buy a few ltrs of antifreeze, drain off something like 2 ltrs of existing coolant and top back up with neat antifreeze. Check after a few days and if the bubbling continues you can be more certain that the head gasket is a real problem. Replacing rear brake pads is one of the simpler jobs and is well covered in the Haynes manual. If you need to replace the disks as well then someone here may be able to find you a servicable pair.

Regards

XMexc

[DrTim]

Peter N thanks for info about hydraulic pump, no I am not sure its faulty, when they did the water pump I was advised it might not last long. I had seen elsewhere they were £300-400 new, so you have reassured me somewhat, not sure if the specialists will fit scrap parts, and I really can't do anything major myself, certainly nothing that requires undercar access.

xmexclusive yes I am looking at the limp on option for now, I have been advised discs are required on the rear as well as pads. Can't really do that myself, maybe at the family home but that is 90mins drive away, don't really want to do that with no rear brakes. The specialists are pretty good on the labour and have been treating the car well for many years.

My co-worker has been telling me scare stories about engines catching fire on motorway due to head gasket going. Is this a realistic worry? Mostly I am just running around town (well, city).


thanks again great to find this group.

[steelcityuk]

I've never heard of a car catching fire because the head gasket is going but that's not to say in extreme circumstances it can't happen. About as much chance as winning the lottery perhaps. Enter the lottery then if your car catches fire you may win....

You'd be surprised how many cheap parts come up on Ebay and on forums like these, just keep a look out for them.

As for running a Xantia instead, I'd say the main advantage is that there are more in the scrap yards so that's the main advantage. I wouldn't say the overall build quality was any better but they do drive differently or at least mine does. The Xantia is like a Mondeo whereas the XM feels like a BX to me.

Other forum to check are -

Aussie Frogs
French Car Forum
XM-L yahoo group

Keep up the struggle.

Steve.

[Peter.N.]

I agree with Steve. I think the only way a failed head gasket would cause a fire, is if you boiled all the water away and the block got red hot! Also regarding the XM/Xantia comparison. The XM is a better quality car, with most Xantia options as standard, much better seats and a better ride, largely because of the extra weight.

Re the hydraulic pump, I dont know how you can tell one is about to fail by looking at it, unless of course its leaking. If it pumps the suspension up and the steering is OK, I wouldn't worry about it.

Peter.N.

[DerekW]

As for doing a 90 min drive with no rear brakes, almost all the braking is done at the front anyway. Some years ago one of my XMs, incidentally a 2.0i, failed its MOT because the rear brake pistons had seized through lack of use - and I didn't even notice it.

Derek

This post has been edited by DerekW on March 28, 2007 05:10 pm

[DrTim]

Thanks again for all the new comments.

I have been perusing ebay recently and noticed the bottom seems to be starting to drop out of the "new" parts market, and there are plenty of people breaking XM's. I've got a wing mirror for 14 quid inc postage which will go on when its warmer and drier and I get the time, the last one only lasted a few weeks :-(, and I'll maybe take on the dodgy window too. I tried today to loosen th door connector as mentioned in another thread, presumably you can get these off to clean the contacts with the dorr on?

I know the Xantia mirrors are much better than the XM ones, which seem very prone to being damaged beyond repair, are the XM series 2 ones any better than the series one?

I also know I much prefer the XM to Xantia if both are working right! If I go for something new to me, cheap and unkown I am worried there will be lots of expensive repairs to do, a close family member has been thru that with a Xantjhia recently (when I'm there in the XM its one Xanthia (was 2) and one BX and an XM in the drive:-). The again I am also worried there will be lots of expensive repairs to do on mine! Thanks for putting up with my rambling.

Thanks also for reassurances about random fires and the hydraulic pump. I also saw some mention in another thread that it might be the belt tension causing issues with the pump. Maybe it will be better if/when I get the new cambelt tensioner fitted. Something is making lots of rattly gurgly noise up there, I'm assuming it is the old tensioner.

Any ideas on the backlight for the temp/time display, I checked the Haynes circuits a while back now and concluded that other stuff would not be working if it was a fuse, but its a bit ambiguous.

regarding rear brakes, sure it still seems to be stopping OK, just I am wondering if I doing more damage to stuff other than the discs with all that grinding noise going on.

oh and is it possible to repair those Clarion radio cassettes? I did have the cassette fixed a while back (running double speed) but left side has been very low in volume for ages and tape physically plays but no sound at all, and recently all the buttons except the on off (including steering wheel controls) are inoperative, occasionally it randomly changes station but it just comes on full blast on whatever station is selected.

thanks again

[DrTim]

Just been reading another thread about leaky boot. I had forgotten that this was a common problem mentioned about XM's when I got mine in '98, I've never had that problem with mine, another reason to hang on for a while I guess.

I did have a small amount of dripping from near the sunroof switches after being parked in some exceptionally heavy rain back in Nov, come to think of it that was the same week I started loosing coolant bigtime and had a tyre unexpectedly go flat with damaged wall overnight.

Is the wet boot thing really down to leaky sunroof?

regards

[techmanagain]

Backlighting to time,etc display is solely due to two failed dashboard-type bulbs. Remember that they are lit whenever the ignition is on, so don't last as long as many others.
Start saving for the new rear discs, but check before you spend. I've got away with it once!

[DrTim]

techmanagain, when you say you got away with it once, I presume you mean you got away with new pads and old discs? Specialists have quoted £130ish plus VAT for pads and discs, maybe I can just whack some pads on myself, time to dig out the Haynes I guess. I suspect they "got away with it" last time though, there's been plenty of making do in recent years.

On mine there is no dot matrix display, just graphical symbols, which I quite like, and to the right at ime/temp display (I think it does trip computer too if you have one fitted) which looked like green LCD to me, are you saying there are bulbs behind there? I suspect it's not easy to replace them:-( The clock and temp are still working, can be read with difficulty in daylight, impossible to read in dark at present.

I had all the dash bulbs done back in 2000 or 2001 and fingers are still crossed and none have gone so far.

thanks

[Peter.N.]

The Mk2 mirrors are much better for visibility but I dont know about durability, I think I have broken three in the last ten years or so.

Many low hydraulic pressure problems are indeed down to the belt slipping, especially on start up and in the first few minutes. The most usual symptom being intermittent heavy steering.

Once you have all the problems fixed they can be very reliable cars. Since I replaced the head gasket on mine about two years ago, I have done 40K + miles with virtually no problems.

Peter.N.